posted 02-14-2018 07:41 PM               

That morning we came from the Orlando area and that's about all I know. I'm guessing around Titusville but do not know.

I have some photos and I know things change in 49 years. In one picture, a bridge or causeway and in the background two water towers, a steeple or monument but by a town, the island off the shoreline looking towards the rocket and the VAB. I have two of the launch not sure of the orientation which is right — VAB on right or left of 39A Pad?

The roadway and causeway and water tower and steeple would be best clues and local knowledge how close you could be to the launch site on roads. The distance of the VAB but not sure of zoom angle of camera in those days. Any help or direction would be great.

Is there anything left in Cocoa Beach that's still here to see of the space program of Gemini or Apollo? In town for a couple of days and no reference to that part of history. Thanks. — Mark Sternat

posted 02-14-2018 09:22 PM               

As far as sights to see in Cocoa Beach:

1. The La Quinta in Cocoa Beach used to be the Cape Colony Inn, which was owned by the 7 Mercury astronauts. There is a plaque (with several misspellings) in the courtyard of the hotel to commemorate he history, and in the lobby area they have a limited display of space program memorabilia.

2. Across the street from the La Quinta is the International Palms hotel, which used to be Henri Landwirth's Holiday Inn (where the Mercury astronauts often stayed when they traveled to the Cape from Langley Air Force Base). There has been a lot of construction in the ensuing 57 years or so, but if you walk around the grounds you can easily distinguish the "Holiday-Inn-looking" buildings and the old pool where many a party was held (I think that's the pool where Gordo Cooper stocked it with fish whose life spans were severely shortened by the chlorine).

3. Just south of the Hilton Oceanfront is Lori Wilson Park, and on the northern edge of that park is a street called "I Dream of Jeannie Lane".

4. Do yourself a favor and visit the Air Force Sands Space History Center, located just outside the south gate of Cape Canaveral Air Force Station. Entry is free (but please leave a nice donation!), and the best part is... talk to the docents! They are virtually all former workers and engineers at the Cape, and they have some GREAT stories to tell!

5. Do yourself another favor and visit the American Space Museum and Walk of Fame in Titusville. There will almost always be someone there who worked at the space center, often several, and they have some GREAT displays.

posted 02-14-2018 10:10 PM               

The next clue in these details is the Mobile Service Structure midway between the launch tower and VAB. To get this perspective the viewing location would be along the waterfront in Titusville near or on the bridge crossing the Indian River on the A Max Brewer Memorial Parkway.

The final clue to confirm this location is the stand of larger trees in the photo. I believe these trees to be located on an island in the river making these trees much closer to the viewer than the trees on the other side of the river.

Using Google Maps I believe if you select street view on a location of Sand Point, Titusville and select a street view location just on the bridge you have a similar view to this photo with the Google Map Camera elevated higher than the Photo Camera lens.

A better resolution copy of this photo would give more detail to better identify the location.

posted 02-15-2018 11:18 AM               

Here is a map if you want to return to the spot. There is a new, taller bridge there today, built recently.

Distance from your vantage point to the launch was 11.5 miles.

posted 02-15-2018 06:38 PM               

I know the first and fourth are the same but did not know the orientation which was correct but I have that correct now, the VAB to the right, launch to the left. I realize the view is to the west as you can see town water towers and steeple in both, but aren't they reversed if I'm looking west?

Would not the people looking to the launch be on the left or south side of the road/bridge where it shows me on the right or north side of the bridge? To me, we would be near the entrance to the bridge maybe around the new launch viewing site built prior to entering the bridge by the water? You would want to be on the south for a southeast east viewing area not on the right north side of the bridge?

posted 02-15-2018 08:52 PM               

Due to the clarity and size of your posted photo I cannot make out how many people or what subject they are looking at, perhaps the helicopter flying along the waterfront seen in the fifth photo. (I have seen footage taken from a similar helicopter with its shadow visible on the waterfront showing people gathered to watch the launch. Perhaps you may be in such footage.) Maybe this photo was taken while people waited for the launch. If I was there on the day I would not turn to take a photo of the crowd as the rocket was climbing skyward.

Your third photo I also cannot make out enough detail to determine if the license tags of the cars are correct or mirrored. This would be the most obvious way to correctly view the photo. Additional details such as what side the steering wheel is or any signage in the background would also work. Once you have the correct view you can then determine what direction the photographer was facing if this photo was taken on the same morning.

posted 02-16-2018 07:18 PM            

Also note that nice old red Mustang is showing its driver side, as evidenced by the silver exterior rearview mirror. Those early models did not have an outside mirror on the passenger side door.

posted 02-17-2018 01:59 AM               

quote:

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Originally posted by sterk03:
Where would I access the photo from the helicopter if we were in it?.

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posted 02-23-2018 03:30 PM               

Sorry I was off for a while visiting fiends. I am back in sunny Pennsylvania (not) and I have the slides. I will look at getting the right orientation. By all the facts I was on the old bridge at Titusville watching the launch and yes the rocket is in view in both photos. I just want to get the exact spot.

The bridge picture shows another road at the angle. I want to know if this is the side entrance and if this is the main entrance to the bridge by the shore before it goes across to Merritt. It has the town too close in the background to be further out in the bay.

To me it could be at where the new Space Launch Park is now but the railings would not make sense.

posted 02-23-2018 10:19 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by sterk03:
I just want to get the exact spot.

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Just doing a quick check with the resolution you have posted seems to show with the position of the island, Launch site, MSS and VAB that the photographer was standing when viewed from Google maps, at a position near water's edge at the bridge. This can be backed up with the people in the foreground and the plant life around them so they are on the shore or base of bridge. If you move the camera south, the island moves to the left of shot too far and if you move the camera position on to the bridge the island would block the launch pad.

The other photos look to have been shot at various points in this area. Be careful estimating how far the town is from the camera because this perspective changes with different focal length camera lens and equipment with longer lens giving a compressed field of view.

posted 02-25-2018 09:15 AM               

But in my photo, the island to the left — now I know its 49 years ago — but I think the island is the one in the Google Earth and in front is a red bouy channel marker and I'm trying to identify this to confirm the island. From the location I am at you can see the red marker just to the left of the island and then trig to the launch site which you have the red/orange glow of the rocket and the VAB. I know this is the spot but I want an exact. I need a aeriel picture of the beginning of the bridge and with the pics I have railing lights cars street intersection I can find the spot.

I have pics of the old bridge but can't zoom in on it. I have noticed from these pics there are three big condos that were not there and this might be part of where we were. They are there with the old bridge pre-2011 but I need a pic prior to the condos to see the start of the causeway.

The first three pictures once the new ones get posted show the red Mustang at the intersection of the V in the road. I am just to the left with the camper and the green boat on top. So we are close I just need an old bridge street view and aerial photo?

posted 02-25-2018 06:56 PM               

Using Google Maps, a similar church steeple is located at the corner of Main St. and Hopkins Ave., Titusville and can be identified as the First Baptist Church. This is a red brick building and the profile of the steeple is the same however the spire may have been repainted. This is not definitive proof because many churches have a similar construction. The crane visible in the second and fourth photo tie these photo locations together. The waterfront area below the helicopter in the second photo seems to match what is Veterans Memorial Park and the site of Wells Fargo bank.

posted 03-02-2018 04:42 PM               

The car with the green boat on is where I was standing as you can see me in the first picture and the boat and Mustang car are in three pictures. The new bridge was built in 2011 and the condos, three of them were present but not sure how long prior to 2011.

What I need is a picture of the old bridge west side prior to 2011 or prior to the condominiums going up. I have one aerial picture of the old bridge but not able to zoom in enough to see the V in the road and positive ID. Also the V in the road has areas on both sides for cars and people.

If you look at the picture taken on the bridge it seems a long way back to the coastline of the town and also the bridge is all over water from the V section. This is the part I am looking for from the air?

I have contacted the historical society of Titusville. There has to be pictures of the bridge or even from 1969 when the historic flight was and local coverage of people on the bridge.

I thank you for your help and I'm very close to the spot. When I was there I tried to take a picture from spots on the shore but none of them was at the same angle and if I could print a photo and use some angles maybe I could get a point. I tried Google Earth but not an expert, but limited views and angles with it. I tried street side but none on the water and limited on the bridge.

posted 03-02-2018 09:52 PM               

quote:

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Originally posted by sterk03:
I am still searching as there are to be historic pictures on Google Maps or Earth that you can go back in time but I would have to be 2011 but I cannot find where you click on to get a prior date?

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posted 03-04-2018 08:28 PM               

Picture 2 has the helicopter and to the right is water where the condos are, so it must be fill to build on. Photo 3 the road to the Y. Just west of the bridge in picture 4 you see land the Y and room for cars to the right. That's because the bridge was two lanes both ways so they are on the north side of the bridge and westbound lanes. You will see the telephone poles well to the right so its all land.

Photo 4 the land just west of the bridge with the man walking over is a small section of the bridge with land on both ends. So where the bridge meets the land west the Y cars and I am on the left and cars and people are on the right. But to the right of this is water again all the way back to Titusville but you can't see it.

The land south of bridge was fill for condos and the land to right was fill for what are ballparks... it fits. It's the only place it could be.

First photo with the rocket the island is in view, it's still there and the water buoy is to the left if you look close and it's still on the nautical map.

When I was there I should have walked the west side of the bridge until I had the same look in the camera as the old photo even though a lot higher. I took one over the first part but this put the island too far out of picture different angle.

Take a look at the below photo (source). You see the bridge and the three condos. Click on it to zoom in just to the right of the condos, where the water starts. This is just a short span from the mainland to another plot of land with a small bridge with a railing like the one with the man walking over. As soon as it reaches the mainland you can see the road and a right turn and a Y.

This is the only area of the bridge it could be at. There is land to the right and land to the left and it's the first section out over the water. You cannot tell how short the bridge is from my photo but it shows the parallel road that the Y takes you to. But really to confirm it I need a prior to condo picture or better yet a 1969 picture.

posted 03-07-2018 05:40 PM               

What I had been calling the Y, the turn off to the right where the people are having lunch, the white spot on the curve, that is the center of the turn on the west side or a V facing us. If you look on the Titusville Harbor link I sent and picture 3 or directly over the bridge facing west towards town and click once to zoom in, find the green roof building right at the water's edge parking lot on the left. (All on the island just east of the condos.) You see the same intersection; it is not a Y, it's a V on the west side. This has to be the turn we see on pic 3.

I can't find it now but it was mentioned the phone poles you see in Apollo no. 3, the line crossing the road to the poles seen on the no. 4 picture you can notice on the Titusville Harbor pics but can't zoom in close. Far right picture Apollo no. 4 you see like a dock or pier and railing or poles but do not see this in any aerial pics from Titusville Harbor.

One last thing the gentleman who drew the lines from the VAB, 39A, launch control back to the land, I believe it's too far south where you have them together to a point. I would like to draw the back using Apollo pic no. 5. Using the island with the buoy sticking out of the water just to the left of the island and the 39A which is orange and the VAB. I'm working on a nautical chart if I can patch it together and draw lines. I think this will bring it just across the street from the V intersection where we are watching.

I watched the clip on camping and it was neat. My parents had the Apache trailer along. I'm not sure why we did not camp, as that is how we got down to Florida from Pennsylvania. We stayed at some dumpy hotel with a major mosquito infested place but thank God we did and I saw the launch, I was lucky.

posted 02-05-2019 10:40 AM               

The pictures all have 2019 and a number after to help sort through this mess. We will start with no. 0. This shows the Max Brewer Bridge and the first section is circled in black, this is Sand Island and it has been identified as the spot where we were, but not the exact spot.

I have been trying to get the exact location to take a picture from the same area some 50 years later. Of course a lot has changed in those 50 years.

Just last month, I located a picture of this island from a museum in Titusville, which is what I have been looking for this past year. It is a big help but the focus of it will not answer all my questions but gives me more then I had. Picture no. 1 is this picture and I will get to the colored circles in a minute.

Let's go to picture no. 2, this is looking to the west towards Sand Island and Titusville and from the bridge you can see it lands on Sand Island and then goes to parallel roads but not much detail as you have with picture no. 1. The next picture shows the same slide blown up with an arrow pointing to a red sign with a white border around it, the location of this sign can be seen with a black arrow pointing to the blue circle on the aerial picture I just found picture no. 1. I call this a billboard but I was informed from the people at the museum that it is a sign showing a warning of an underground cable in the water by the island. This sign is no longer there but this picture has made my spot that much more certain.

posted 02-05-2019 10:43 AM               

Picture no. 8 shows the rocket, boat in the river the island to the left and the VAB on the right and then the arrow to the billboard or sign and this is where we were sitting just to the left or east of the sign. Picture no. 9 shows this quite well as my father snapped a couple of pics with the sign/billboard just to the right of where we were sitting.

So the intersection and the cars shows us to be abeam the camper and boat and the billboard, so I know I was on that section of the island, which I could not verify until this picture no. 1 was found. It was taken in 1970, not at the Apollo 11 launch, but not much had changed in that one year. So what I am still after with all those people on this island in 1969 there has to be someone like me or my father that snapped a bunch of pictures and maybe of different angles different directions which could show the sign, cars, intersection, surroundings better then the blurred overhead aerial picture. So I haven't stopped yet looking.

posted 05-11-2019 11:22 PM            

The wooden billboard in picture 9 can also be seen in the aerial film footage.

posted 05-12-2019 02:55 AM               

I took a screen capture of the film, carried out some enhancements including Dehaze, colour adjustment and sharpening. You can make out the camper with the green boat, the red pop top camper, and what looks to be the tent made from blankets, all adjacent to the sign.

The vehicles parked on the area between the east and west bound lanes also match the pattern of vehicles within the photographs.

posted 05-12-2019 07:41 AM            

I agree with the new location in your first paragraph. The smaller grass median between the east and west lanes matches.

posted 06-19-2019 06:41 AM               

View from above - possibly from the VAB roof? - of a crowded parking lot on launch day. Research by J.L. Pickering.

posted 06-19-2019 07:30 AM            

The Apollo Image Gallery (my link) does not have a description for the photo.

posted 12-20-2019 10:09 AM               

The only real mark is this billboard. If I had a ground picture of the area and the board. The first two seconds of the movie you see the billboard in question, and it does look like what's in my photo.

The picture still is not from the VAB, I know that. I'm not sure how you zoomed in and saw the car and still looking for the tail light you mention? That was the problem with the original slides, the depth of field could not be told?

The picture of someone walking over the bridge looks like the second section of the bridge, not the first. If you look at Titusville in the distance, you see water between the bridge section and shore, so it looks like not the mainland of Titusville. Also that bridge shows a billboard but distance is hard to judge. If that is the same billboard in the slide it looks very far away from the second bridge section. The two road sections look the same on land as Titusville and the next bridge so hard to tell.

If this picture is Apollo 11, then the true test is a good picture of the cars abeam the billboard. They would be our White Fury, the green Camaro and the red Mustang but also the camper with the green boat.

Sorry I did not see these post in early 2019. I don't know why. I was on this site all summer with the 50th anniversary and thought there would be more posts. I still would like to track down the kid (adult) that was sitting up on the billboard.

posted 12-26-2019 05:51 PM               

Thanks for bringing this to my attention.

You have Photo 2019-1 showing the view from east looking west and the billboard is on the very top section but too far to see clearly and you have the 71-hc-040 showing from west to east and the billboard is at the far east, again out of focus, but where is the middle photo? That's what is missing.