posted 05-27-2007 05:39 PM               

2007 September Grand Format Space Exploration Auction
Heritage Auction Galleries' Auction #669

The floor auction is being held in Dallas, TX on Thursday, September 20, 2007. Online bidding ends at 10:00PM CT the night before the floor session.

posted 05-28-2007 06:24 AM               

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Originally posted by benguttery:
Can you ever have too many space auctions?

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This may be a prime time for a well-respected auction house to jump into the space biz. Think about it - Aurora got some pretty severe pans over their last auction, and Orenstein is leaving Superior. A good dependable auction house to compete with the established space auction houses may be just what our hobby needs!

posted 08-29-2007 09:20 AM               

• From the collection of renowned former physical trainer of the astronauts Joe Garino.
  
• From the estate of Dr. D. Owen Coons, Chief of NASA's Manned Spacecraft Center Medical Office.
  
• From the personal collection of Dr. Buzz Aldrin.

What do people with more experience than me in space program auctions (i.e., anyone reading this) think of the auction in general, or specific lots?

posted 08-29-2007 11:50 AM               

However, they're falling short in customer service and IMHO, they're making a big mistake. They're not allowing live Ebay bidding or any other type of live bidding. If you're bidding online, you must have your bids in by 10PM the night before the auction. What's up with that?

I'm interested in quite a few pieces, but they're expecting me to make a blind bid? How can they expect anyone to place a bid, that's possibly thousands of dollars over what it would have sold for on the floor?

The point of an auction is to sell an item for what the audience is willing to pay for it, not to garner blind bids that are either way over what it would have sold for, or can be easily be outbid by a floor bidder.

I've attended many Superior auctions where there are "book" bids for huge money that exceed any floor bid by many hundreds or thousands of dollars. I suspect these "book" bids are either reserve prices set by the consignor or bids by people who have more money than brains. Everytime a "book" bid wins for insane money, all of the floor bidders look at each other, as if to say, "who's the crazy person that bought that piece"?

I think it's a very poor choice on Heritages part not to offer live bidding for internet buyers. This sale can go 1 of 2 ways, either bring in huge bids by internet buyers with unlimited funds or the guys attending the auction can snag the item from any internet bid for a couple of dollars more. Either way the internet buyer is the one getting the shaft by having to bid in the blind.

posted 08-29-2007 12:32 PM               

That, along with the online bids not being accepted the day of the auction, certainly will discourage some potential bidders. Too bad- holes in a lot of collections could be filled there.

I've seen that laptop on at least one other site for a shockingly high price. I think someone paid a lot for it years ago.

posted 08-29-2007 12:46 PM               

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Originally posted by Spacepsycho:
I'm interested in quite a few pieces, but they're expecting me to make a blind bid?

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After Internet bidding ends, your secret maximum will compete for you against the floor bidders. Place your most realistic bids to have a greater chance of winning against those bidders. Many of our proxy bidders are successful at winning lots in these auctions, and usually below their secret maximum.

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posted 08-29-2007 01:25 PM               

I'm particularly taken with the huge and exhaustive hi-res scans of every item, and the lengthy unambiguous wording of the descriptions. Not to mention the entire catalogue being presented online 3 weeks prior to the sale. In a market where authenticity is all important these are the standards that we should expect from all auction houses.

posted 08-30-2007 07:56 AM               

• The Gemini 5 patch is not the one worn by the crew, but rather the version previously sold from Cooper's collection as flown. When this design was seen previously it was questioned as to whether it was actually flown or whether Cooper mistakenly thought this 30 years after the event. This one at least seems to have been presented (by Cooper) at around the time of the mission itself, so it's not really a question of too much time having passed.

• The Gemini 6 is a GTA-6 version, which is probably to be expected.

• The Gemini 7 is the version with the crew names at the top rather than the version worn by the crew.

• The Gemini 8 through 12 patches are all the known crew versions, with the Gemini 9 having the crew name tab at the bottom.

• The Apollo flown flag presentations also have some nice crew patches:

• An Apollo 8 flown patch and flown flag.

• An Apollo 9 crew patch with a flown flag.

• Two Apollo 10 crew patches, both the post-flight jump suit versions rather than the pre-flight portrait Grumman versions.

• An Apollo 11 crew patch (BIG version).

• The Apollo 12 flown flag presentation is mounted with a patch that I don't recognise. It's not the crew version or the AB Emblem patch. It's not listed as flown, but still must be contemporary with the flight and obviously available to NASA personnel at the time.

• A flown Apollo 13 crew patch.

• The Apollo 14 flown flag is accompanied by a Lion Brothers Apollo 14 patch but this is not noted as flown. From the extracts of the accompanying letters it does seem that it might have come from Ed Mitchell though.

• A nice flown sliver thread Apollo 15 crew patch, with flown flag.

posted 08-30-2007 06:36 PM               

I only live about 3 hours from Dallas now and I may drive in for this auction.

posted 09-01-2007 04:26 AM               

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Originally posted by Novaspace:
Heritage was in a booth at Spacefest, handing out free catalogs (as was Regency-Superior)

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Paul

posted 09-01-2007 06:56 AM               

The quality of the online catalogue is outstanding - particularly the zoom/pan/focus feature, which should be the standard for ALL auctions. There's so much mouth-watering stuff.

posted 09-01-2007 07:21 AM               

Cheers,
Matt

posted 09-01-2007 11:14 AM               

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Originally posted by gliderpilotuk:
The auction WILL BE on Ebay Live. Just check Ebay.

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posted 09-02-2007 07:08 PM               

I have tried individually to help the space market over the years, including publishing the two books on the Robbins Medals, lobbying NGC to certify the Robbins Medals, and to write articles to better educate the collector base. I have not previously lent my name to any of the action houses. Although grateful for their efforts and realizing that if they had not had an auction that there would be few artifacts publicly offered, it still seemed that their primary focus was to sell any and all things, and as much of it, regardless of quality and sometimes authenticity.

I have been a long time client of Heritage’s. In fact, I am considered a legacy client because of the amount I have spent with them over the years. I lobbied them nearly 3 years ago to become involved with the space market, but they were not then ready. I believe that the space community will be very pleased as Heritage gets its legs over the next year. I think the days of the auction forum being filled only with complaints are nearing an end. I envision the biggest complaint going forward will be that prices are going up. I personally think we space collectors have been living in a bubble, and have had the opportunity of a lifetime to acquire as many of the greatest artifacts ever offered at relatively inexpensive prices. But we shall see, as no one knows for sure.

posted 09-04-2007 08:07 PM               

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Originally posted by lunareagle:
Although I have always been grateful for the efforts put forth by the other auction houses, I have been disappointed that none have endeavored to really grow and nurture the hobby.

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posted 09-04-2007 10:17 PM               

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Important notice: Heritage usually auctions material at the rate of 100-110 lots per hour. On some occasions eBay Live bid software or the Internet may not be able to keep up with the pace of the auction. We recommend placing a realistic absentee bid now as insurance to avoid disappointment. Occasionally the auctioneer may eliminate or reject an eBay Live bid, and the auctioneer may also reopen a lot after the close of the eBay live bidding (usually because we missed an audience bid), and may reject your bid even if it shows you as the winning bidder. By bidding via eBay Live, you agree that Heritage may award the lot to another bidder at its sole discretion under the circumstances described above or any other reasonable circumstances. Since eBay bids are not shown to us until we open the lot on the floor, we treat those bids just like floor bids. In most cases the floor responds before the eBay bid is presented to us, due to Internet lag time, so for consistency we have made it a policy that floor bids are always considered first over tie eBay live bids. Also please note that all Heritage lots purchased through eBay Live carry a 22.5% Buyer's Premium with a $9 minimum Buyer's Premium. Please make sure you read the Terms and Conditions before you bid. This lot is being auctioned in conjunction with a live floor auction by Heritage Auctions. All final auction and invoice information will be supplied by Heritage Auctions, and all other information should be considered preliminary.

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posted 09-05-2007 07:17 AM               

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Originally posted by Outerspace:
Here's the question: what proof is there that the items (the slide rule and the coin) were carried in Aldrin's suit on the EVA?

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Your point is truly a valid one, and one that the community should and needs to weigh in on. My personal position is as follows:

1. I believe that none of the astronauts I know or have known have ever knowingly offered any items to deceive.

2. A personal COA from an astronaut for his own items, flown or unflown, has to stand as credible, EXCEPT if official documentation were to surface that would dispute that fact, which would seemingly over ride the astronaut’s COA claim of flown or location status, which is what the dispute would be about. The fact that they belonged to and were from the astronaut’s collection would remain valid. The key here is that the above refers to an item directly from an astronaut’s own mission where he purportedly had knowledge and control of the item, not one necessarily given to him by another astronaut from another mission.

   The grey area here is that nearly all astronauts are extremely guarded about disclosing what was in their CM PPKs, more so about their LM PPKs and even more so about items that may have been in their suits. Astronauts have told me more than once, including moonwalkers, that they had a number of personal items in their suits. Further, some of the astronauts still have their PPK manifests and some do not, while others only have copies of letters to the flight office that list the contents of their PPKs.

So, getting back to your question about the Aldrin slide rule and coin. As Dr. Aldrin will tell you, he is a West Point graduate and lives by a code of honor. He states that these items were taken to the surface. Given that, unless evidence ever surfaces to say otherwise, I don’t think that it can be disputed.

posted 09-06-2007 03:11 PM               

"I feel relatively sure that they would come off but they seem to be glued or adhered in some way."

posted 09-06-2007 11:15 PM               

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Originally posted by spaced out:
Since genuine Gemini crew patches are so scarce it's very interesting to see the complete set from Joe Garino's collection. All are listed as flown although it's not so clear from the descriptions if the accompanying LOAs state this explicitly.

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I don't know if the print catalog states it differently, but the online catalog does NOT state that the Gemini X patch was "space flown," unlike the other Gemini patches which are claimed to be flown.

posted 09-12-2007 08:33 AM               

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Scott Schneeweis

posted 09-14-2007 03:41 PM               

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Originally posted by Outerspace:
Here's the question: what proof is there that the items (the slide rule and the coin) were carried in Aldrin's suit on the EVA?

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In each case, our lot writer was initially working from notes, which had not been confirmed with Dr. Buzz Aldrin himself, and as a result incorrectly made the claim that these two items had positively been on his person while Dr. Aldrin made his famous moonwalk.

While both items were flown aboard the mission, neither was actually on the moon's surface.

The slide rule was taken by Dr. Aldrin as a back-up tool that would allow him to perform calculations in the event of a computer failure on the Apollo 11 mission, and he saw the opportunity to bring along the silver dollar in his PPK as a unique souvenir, so he did.

Accordingly, we are posting corrections on our web site and will announce them prior to the commencement of the live auction as well. Any bids placed on these two lots earlier have been removed from the system, and the bidders so advised and invited to place new bids based on the updated information about these items.

Lot 26368 - Buzz Aldrin's Apollo 11 Slide Rule - Flown to the Moon. A Pickett Model N600-ES (Eye Saver) Log Log Speed Rule, a six-inch pocket rule with 22 five-inch scales. Most of today's cell phones have much more computing power than the Apollo 11 mission carried on board. Though they seem archaic to many of this present generation, the slide rule was (and is) a powerful computational tool and would certainly come in very handy on a space flight. The rule offered here was used on and flown to the moon aboard the Apollo 11 mission by Dr. Aldrin. The Pickett Company, founded in 1943, was proud of the fact that NASA selected this slide rule model of theirs to fly on five of the Apollo missions; they used that fact in their advertising of the period. Research shows that the N600-ES would have sold for $10.95 at retail in 1969 (one wonders what NASA paid). Very fine condition. From the personal collection of Dr. Buzz Aldrin and accompanied by a signed Letter of Authenticity from him.

posted 09-14-2007 07:18 PM            

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Originally posted by driftingtotheright:
Do you know if the A11 descent chart and beta cloth checklist bag were lunar surface flown?

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posted 09-15-2007 07:20 AM               

Buzz locking the lunar module after exit
Wally hitting the ejection switch on Gemini V1
(although quite justified)
Glenn jettisoning the retro pack
McCandless not fastening his seatbelt in the MMU

posted 09-15-2007 03:36 PM               

The Descent or Orbital Monitoring Charts are flown to the surface and were usually taped into a continous ring, so they could access a particular section, if necessary, quickly.

The most of moonwalkers have separated the sections for individual sale and the average chart had between 18 and 24 sections, so there are other sections from Apollo 11, Apollo 16 and Apollo 17 out in the hobby.

I do have a question of the Goddard book that Heritage should check on. Did Buzz take two Goddard books to the Moon?