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Author
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Topic: Banish Bonds' baseball to space...
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Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42981
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 09-18-2007 01:21 AM
   
From The New York Times' blog, The Lede:
Bonds Ball May Be Space Bound  quote:
Back when hometown hero Matt Murphy snagged Barry Bonds's 756th home run ball in San Francisco, the experts estimated that the ball would probably go for $500,000, and possibly up to $700,000 due to the steroid cloud besmirching the feat.But no one was counting on Marc Ecko to enter Sotheby's with the most determined auction paddle of the bunch. The hip-hop fashion mogul surpassed all estimates with a final bid of $752,467. On the "Today" show this morning, he said that he would've gone even higher, having refused to set a ceiling nor consult with his wife. "I had the resources and the means, and I told my friends I was going to win it," he said according to a transcript. "And I did." And why did he want to win so badly? The answer showed his flair for unorthodox marketing tactics and a penchant for experiments in interactivity. "I wanted to democratize the ball," he said. That meant launching a Web site that offers the world three choices on the future of the baseball: give it to the Hall of Fame with or without a huge asterisk burned into the cowhide, or send it into space. "Out of sight, out of mind," the third choice reasons. Mr. Ecko is voting for the asterisk; You have until Sept. 25th to pick for yourself.
You can enter your vote here: www.vote756.com Few if any details are provided about how the ball would be launched should the public pick that option, but Ecko is apparently of the means (e.g. spending $752,467 for the ball in the first place, only to give it away, let alone evict it from Earth) to make it happen. |
Rizz
Member Posts: 1208
From: Upcountry, Maui, Hawaii
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 09-18-2007 01:36 AM
That ball should go right into a garbage dumpster.Hank Aaron hit all his HR's with honor and without dope. He is a true athlete. But not to worry Bonds fans. Big Barry will probably be in the Baseball Hall of Fame with the likes of Pete Rose. How appropriate. |
Rick
Member Posts: 379
From: Yadkinville, NC
Registered: Jun 2000
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posted 09-18-2007 03:52 AM
Actually, Pete Rose is NOT in the Hall of Fame due to his banishment from the game. Therein lies the problem. Bonds will likely go into the Hall at some point, but not Rose. Say what you will about him, but Rose played as hard as anyone ever has, if not harder. Yes, he is a complete and utter jerk. But the Hall is based on accomplishments on the field, not character. If it was a Character Hall of Fame, many would be out ... Ty Cobb, Cap Anson (who almost single-handedly established the unwritten rule that African-Americans could not play in the majors), Babe Ruth, Mickey Mantle ... the list could go on. Personally, I voted to brand the Bonds ball with an asterisk and then send it on its way to Cooperstown. |
Scott
Member Posts: 3307
From: Houston, TX
Registered: May 2001
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posted 09-18-2007 06:29 AM
Thank goodness! Good for Marc! The asterisk option is pretty funny, though as a space fan I'd kinda like seeing it launched. |
SRB
Member Posts: 258
From:
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 09-18-2007 08:43 AM
Sounds like "cheap" publicity for Marc Ecko at three quarters of a million. I'm sure he will write this entire cost off as a tax deduction. |
Cliff Lentz
Member Posts: 655
From: Philadelphia, PA USA
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 09-18-2007 12:44 PM
If we can't send Barry, it's the next best thing! Vote Early, Vote Often! Cliff |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 09-18-2007 01:00 PM
I would vote to put the asterisk on it (along with a burned in note saying how Bonds cheated) and then launch it into space. That way, the record of Bond's dishonorable record will outlive the human race.Although I also like how the ball that the fan tried to catch during the Cubs playoff game was eventually blown up. I think they should do that to this ball, then auction off the shards for charity. |
FFrench
Member Posts: 3161
From: San Diego
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 09-18-2007 01:10 PM
This is, of course, all assuming that OJ Simpson's associates don't try and "reclaim" this piece of memorabilia for Barry in an armed raid... |
Moonpaws
Member Posts: 685
From: Lee's summit, MO
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 09-18-2007 04:46 PM
The numbers say it all:Baseball Achievements: - All-time Major League Home Run leader
- 7 MVPs
- 13-time All Star
- 8 Gold Gloves
- 12 Silver Slugger Awards
- Third member of 700 Home Run Club
- Only member in 500/500 Club
- Single Season Home Run King (73)
- Two-time N.L. Batting Champion (2002, 2004)
- Player of the Decade for the 1990's by The Sporting News
- All-time Major League walks leader
- Set single-season walks (232) and intentional walks (120) record
- Set single-season OBP record (.609)
- Holds Major League record for consecutive seasons with 30-or-more HR, accomplishing this 13 times
If, and I say if he used something, certainly he hasn't for the last few years. So how come he still hits em farther, more(on an age prorated basis), and his slg and on base percentage blows everyone else away. Why do the majority of major leaguers respect what he has done? It's because as professionals, they know more than the average fan as to what it takes to accomplish those things listed above. If you're going to point fingers, you might want to point at your favorite player as well. I think that is what irks me most about the criticism. It's pure hypocrisy to single out 1 player and ignore the rest of the league. To do anything other than put the ball in the hall of fame is a pure act of disgrace. To mark it is dangerous in nature. Do we also want this joker to buy other memorabilia and subject these to the same insane process? Maybe we should expose all the national treasures in our museums to a popular vote so that we can mark those pieces thereby presenting the popular vote and bias to each visiting person. I personally don't want to look at the Enola Gay (is it still in existence?) at a museum and read some other persons' revisionist point of view. Should we put a big asterisk on the aircraft? It is what is it. Let each person come to their own conclusion without subjecting all of us to the altering of the artifact as it was when history was made. |
Scott
Member Posts: 3307
From: Houston, TX
Registered: May 2001
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posted 09-18-2007 05:48 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Moonpaws:
.... To do anything other than put the ball in the hall of fame is a pure act of disgrace. To mark it is dangerous in nature...
How about a compromise? Put it in the Hall of Fame, but with a hypodermic needle sticking out of it. The hole in the ball would be very small, so permanent damage to it would be minimal. Or maybe it could be coated with a clear substance (i.e., "The Cream"). The real disgrace is that this person was ever allowed to "break" Aaron's record. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42981
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 09-18-2007 05:57 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Moonpaws:
I personally don't want to look at the Enola Gay (is it still in existence?) at a museum and read some other persons' revisionist point of view.
The Enola Gay is restored and on display at the Udvar Hazy Center in Virginia. Unlike Bonds' baseball, there is a value to inspiring discussion and debate over the Enola Gay, as it quite literally meant the life and death of thousands of people.With regards to the baseball, I just find it funny that people are so upset over alleged steroid use. There isn't a sport you can name where new technologies haven't been employed to improve player performance, thus it is kind of hypocritical to start pointing fingers when that technology extends to the human body itself. Maybe steroid use should be encouraged: it would not only put everyone back on a level playing field but it might actually justify the multi-million dollar salaries paid if there was a real risk that the player might drop dead while rounding third... |
Moonpaws
Member Posts: 685
From: Lee's summit, MO
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 09-18-2007 06:24 PM
Robert, your point is well taken and I agree that cultivating discussion is healthy. Discussing is one thing, altering artifacts is another. I can understand people's emotions and the booing and holding up asterisks. That is their right. I can't think of anyone I hate in professional sports. There are some players that I don't care for, but to watch the pure hatred for Bonds shows me that some people have unresolved private issues. Hate is an emotion that originates from fear and ignorance. Ecko is just seeking to exploit this in a blatant misuse of his wealth. I'm not against the vote (I voted 20 times), I'm against the proposed actions. |
MarylandSpace
Member Posts: 1336
From:
Registered: Aug 2002
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posted 09-18-2007 08:17 PM
I would suggest putting multiple asterisks on the ball so the HOF could not sit the ball on a single asterisk (and hide it).Inject the ball with steroids, too. The guy was a tremendous athlete before he started cheating. |
Moonpaws
Member Posts: 685
From: Lee's summit, MO
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 09-18-2007 08:36 PM
I only know of two people who have been caught cheating in sports recently. One rode a bike on a tour, the other lives in New England. Of course that doesn't count because in that case there is actual proof, which is absent in the case of Bonds. A Fox baseball broadcaster penned the phrase "the era of steroids" in regard to the last decade of baseball. I don't think that phrase has anything to do with 1 person. No offense hopefully to my friends in New England as I like both the Sox and Patriots.
Boston is a jewel of a city as I recently visited and had the privilege of ringing the bell on the floor of the Boston Stock Exchange. |
DC Giants
Member Posts: 135
From: Kansas City, MO USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted 09-18-2007 10:39 PM
The ball is pretty much meaningless to me so I voted for the asterisk. Of course, being a St. Louis Cardinals fan I may be a little biased about Bonds..... |
Rodina
Member Posts: 836
From: Lafayette, CA
Registered: Oct 2001
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posted 09-19-2007 08:47 AM
quote:
Originally posted by DC Giants:
The ball is pretty much meaningless to me so I voted for the asterisk. Of course, being a St. Louis Cardinals fan I may be a little biased about Bonds.....
McGwire, of course, was pure as the driven snow.
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Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42981
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 09-19-2007 09:06 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Moonpaws:
I voted 20 times
Unless you changed your IP address each time between votes, it is likely that your clicks will only be counted as one vote. |
LadyCosmos
New Member Posts:
From:
Registered:
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posted 09-19-2007 06:21 PM
Here is the response from Barry Bonds:
Associated Press: Bonds: Man who bought record-breaking home run ball is an 'idiot' |
randy
Member Posts: 2176
From: West Jordan, Utah USA
Registered: Dec 1999
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posted 09-19-2007 07:24 PM
Space is too good for it. Is that any way we want to be represented to anybody who might find it out there, the "record breaking" ball hit by the man who cheated to get it there?Randy |
Moonpaws
Member Posts: 685
From: Lee's summit, MO
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 09-19-2007 08:21 PM
There are about 1000 major leaguers on the active rosters. One commentator on ESPN reported that up to 50% of the players may have used some type of performance enhancing drugs. That seems a bit high to me, but even at 25%, there would have been about 250 players using something. If that be the case, it seems a bit skewed to point fingers at just 1 player. It also is interesting that those who want to toss the first stones are often dissuaded when confronted with the writing in the sand. It is often conjecture as to what was written, but some historians have suggested that it was the names of women with whom the zealots had committed the same errors as the woman in question. Now as to not jeopardize the discussion by becoming devisive, a baseball in space would certainly be categorized as a "Fastball" and a "Curveball". |
Rob Joyner
Member Posts: 1308
From: GA, USA
Registered: Jan 2004
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posted 09-19-2007 11:53 PM
You forgot "screwball".
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DC Giants
Member Posts: 135
From: Kansas City, MO USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted 09-22-2007 11:09 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Rodina:
McGwire, of course, was pure as the driven snow.
That's why I am a Cardinal fan as opposed to worshiping any one player. And on that note, although they are just human beings too, my hero worship is reserved to astronauts rather than sports figures. Patrick |
Mike Z
Member Posts: 451
From: Ellicott City, Maryland
Registered: Dec 2005
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posted 09-23-2007 10:19 AM
I'm sure Babe Ruth, Lou Geghrig & the other players who have passed on are turning in their graves. They did not have steroids in their day. When Gehrig set his streak there were no streiods or even sports medicine!! He had broken his fingers over a dozen times. The Babe drank and ate too many hot dogs.In my 9 years in Major League Baseball, there was only one player that we knew was juicing and that was with Dianabol which is like candy compaired to today's steroids. My last 5 years I ran the visiting clubhouse until 1983. I knew the entire American League, the Phillies and the Pirates. We likes all but 4 players. Now I'm told by a good friend who is in the Hall of Fame,(NOT Brooks Robinson!) that today's players have changed! My last year on pro sports with a double A team, ALL the players told me that Bonds was NOT liked by the other players, the press and fans and that he could care less!! I think all records set by today's players SHOULD have an asterisk next to their names just like should be painted on the ball Bounds hit out for 756!! That's my 2 cents worth!! Mike Z |
AstronautBrian
Member Posts: 287
From: Louisiana
Registered: Jan 2006
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posted 09-23-2007 10:56 AM
I liked your post Mike.In my fandom and study of baseball over the years, statistics seem to have been divided up into two eras - the pre-Babe Ruth (circa 1876-1919) and post-Babe Ruth era (1920 +). This was done more or less to reflect the changes in the game to to compare players to the standards of their time. Now it seems like we may to add a third era. When to find a starting point for this third era will have to be determined by history. I am an Atlanta Braves fan. I've followed them since the 80's when they stunk. I never liked Barry Bonds since his Pirates days. He just comes across as a big, arrogant jerk. Some may say he's a jerk because he is a star player, but he doesn't have to be. Cal Ripken, Tony Gywnn, Kirby Puckett and many others are not jerks. To have someone like Bonds, steroids or no steroids, break Hank Aaron's record rubs me the wrong way. ------------------
"There's a meaning there, but the meaning there doesn't really mean a thing." - Russell Morris |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 09-23-2007 10:15 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Z:
The Babe drank and ate too many hot dogs.
The Babe preferred to to use performance-degrading drugs! |
Lunar rock nut
Member Posts: 911
From: Oklahoma city, Oklahoma U.S.A.
Registered: Feb 2007
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posted 09-26-2007 07:53 AM
The vote is in via Good Morning America.10 million votes. No rocket ride. The Asterisk wins with 80% of the vote. Terry |
Moonpaws
Member Posts: 685
From: Lee's summit, MO
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 09-26-2007 09:35 PM
That is inaccurate. 47% voted to brand it. |
FutureAstronaut
Member Posts: 372
From:
Registered: Mar 2006
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posted 09-27-2007 12:33 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Moonpaws:
That is inaccurate. 47% voted to brand it.
I think it was 80% that voted to send it to Cooperstown, 47% to brand it, and 33% to send it unmarked.------------------
Mike |
Scott
Member Posts: 3307
From: Houston, TX
Registered: May 2001
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posted 09-27-2007 07:56 AM
It is actually:Bestow: 34% Brand: 47% Launch: 19% http://www.vote756.com/marcecko/ |
Lunar rock nut
Member Posts: 911
From: Oklahoma city, Oklahoma U.S.A.
Registered: Feb 2007
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posted 09-27-2007 08:22 AM
I was wrong about the source. I was listening to NBC's Today show instead of GMA of ABC. I heard Matt L. say that 80% of the vote was to send it to Cooperstown and brand it. It might have led to some interesting events down the road had it been banished to the moon. Within the next hundered years it probably would have been recovered and brought back anyway. Imagine the turmoil that would cause. Terry |
MarylandSpace
Member Posts: 1336
From:
Registered: Aug 2002
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posted 09-27-2007 10:42 AM
I think it needs an asterisk on two opposite faces so the Hall of Fame can't "hide" the asterisk out of view.Garry |
FutureAstronaut
Member Posts: 372
From:
Registered: Mar 2006
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posted 09-27-2007 02:33 PM
quote:
Originally posted by MarylandSpace:
I think it needs an asterisk on two opposite faces so the Hall of Fame can't "hide" the asterisk out of view.
I think it needs to be respected as baseball history, tainted or not.------------------
Mike |
mjanovec
Member Posts: 3811
From: Midwest, USA
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted 09-27-2007 04:11 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Lunar rock nut:
I was wrong about the source. I was listening to NBC's Today show instead of GMA of ABC. I heard Matt L. say that 80% of the vote was to send it to Cooperstown and brand it.
Note that both option 1 and 2 included sending the ball to Cooperstown. If you add the votes to bestow (34%) and the votes to brand (47%), you end up with 81% of the people voting to send the ball to Cooperstown. |
Moonpaws
Member Posts: 685
From: Lee's summit, MO
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 12-13-2007 06:20 PM
Well, now that the report is out, it appears that just about everyone who played MLB
in the 90's possibly used something. Where is the ball now? Was is permanently branded? If it is at the hall, is the brand visible? |
Scott
Member Posts: 3307
From: Houston, TX
Registered: May 2001
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posted 12-13-2007 07:25 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Moonpaws:
Well, now that the report is out, it appears that just about everyone who played MLB in the 90's possibly used something.
That's not what I'm taking from the report at all. It appears that a lot of cheats were using something. |
Mike Z
Member Posts: 451
From: Ellicott City, Maryland
Registered: Dec 2005
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posted 12-14-2007 12:03 AM
One thing for sure, the 80 names that have been published are not all the players who were doping or juicing! There are players that somehow did not get named. Some may have been warned that the people were coming to do the drug testing long enough that everything was out of their blood. None of these players should ever be on a Hall of Fame ballott.Mike Z |
ejectr
Member Posts: 1751
From: Killingly, CT
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 12-14-2007 06:42 AM
I don't condone the use of anything that gives someone an unfair advantage over another when it comes to competing, but what I also tell myself before I rush to judgment is that these are "performance enhancing" drugs, not "talent enhancing" drugs. They all had to have the talent to get to where they are in the first place. I try not to confuse the two.I never "boo" anyone at sports events. Not umpires, referees or players. I figure...there's a world of difference between the fact that they're on the field or floor and I'm in the stands. That simple fact alone tells me I should give them all the respect they deserve while I sit on the sidelines and watch them work. We're all obviously rocked and some of us disappointed with what we now have read, heard and seen, but I try not to forget that it wasn't the substances that got them the job, it was the talent and the talent is what I still enjoy watching. |
clifford
Member Posts: 233
From: Maplewood, nj, 07040
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 12-14-2007 03:07 PM
It is one level of stupidity to cheat and take something that can hurt your health. It is another whole level of stupidity to pay for it with a signed personal check. I am amazed that anyone can be THAT stupid !Clifford. |
onesmallstep
Member Posts: 1310
From: Staten Island, New York USA
Registered: Nov 2007
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posted 12-14-2007 05:04 PM
With the Mitchell report out today on doping and steroids mentioning Roger Clemens, I guess now we can send the 'Rocket' up on a real rocket!!
-Al |
Mike Z
Member Posts: 451
From: Ellicott City, Maryland
Registered: Dec 2005
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posted 12-14-2007 05:53 PM
I do agree that these ahtletes need the talent to get where they are. The steroids make them much more intense competitors. They also have more endurance & able to heal faster from playing and injuries. These athletes cannot turn off the rage and some go home and beat their wives or girlfriends. I personally know a well known athlete who was beating his wife. She bought a house to live in away from him. They are back together now that he has retired. Another took a beer bottle and smashed over his wife's head.Mike Z |
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