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Author
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Topic: FOIA response to space shuttle tile inquiry
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Rocket Chris
Member Posts: 342
From:
Registered: Nov 2009
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posted 11-18-2011 04:11 AM
   
A few day ago a European collector offered me a shuttle tile without any paperwork. I was interested in this tile and so I wrote a Freedom of information Act to the JSC with the ask if this tile was an original one and where and when it was taken from which shuttle. The tile was damaged at a place where one number of the Rockwell ID could not be identified. The tile got the number V070- 191012- X37-008695 where X is the number i could not identify.Now I got an answer and I do not really understand what I should do or what NASA wants to say (my english is sometimes poor): A very extensive and due diligent search was performed by the Shuttle Transition and Retirement Office and the lSC Records Office and the documents were unable to be located. Since you are receiving a "no records" response, we must advise you of your appeal rights. You are advised that you may appeal to the NASA Administrator. Your appeal must: (1) be addressed to the Administrator, National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA), Mail Stop: FOrA, Room 9R17, 300 E Street, SW, Washington, DC 20546; (2) be clearly identified on the envelope and in the letter as an "Appeal under the Freedom of Information Act;" (3) include a copy of the request for the Agency record, and a copy of the contested initial determination; (4) to the extent possible, state JSC-FOlA-XX-XXX X the reasons you believe the initial determination should be reversed; and (5) be sent to the Administrator within 30 calendar days of the receipt of this initial determination. Does NASA want to bust me just because I wanted some information? Or do I have to explain something right? I do not know how I should react as a non U.S. citizen. The tile is already in Europe and was given to a collector 15 years before as a present directly from NASA. |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42981
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-18-2011 04:20 AM
This response has nothing to do with NASA trying to "bust" you, nor is it specifically related to your request being about a space shuttle tile.When FOIA requests are unable to return any related records, the requester has the right to appeal if s/he feels the agency's search was inadequate. Though it doesn't really apply in your situation, if you feel that the agency must have information related to your inquiry, then you could appeal, asking for the search to be expanded. You would have received this type of reply regardless of what it was you were seeking information about so long as NASA was unable to locate any records. |
garymilgrom
Member Posts: 1966
From: Atlanta, GA
Registered: Feb 2007
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posted 11-18-2011 04:25 AM
Whoa! I believe you have received a simple automated response. They cannot process your request is all this says. You can appeal (basically ask again), but it's well known that NASA has/had no database of tile locations. It is very hard to determine where a single tile came from. There is a thread on this forum that says the tile number you gave is from a lower wing area (denoted by the 191 digits). If so, it should look like the left hand tile below - it should be very thick.  I would advise not purchasing any tile if you are not a US citizen and reside outside the United States. It is again well known that the tile technology is protected under ITAR and tiles are not supposed to leave this country. The fact that this one has been in Europe for X years does not legalize it. If you want to avoid any chance of getting in trouble, stay away. I guess the ability to own Shuttle tiles is simply another advantage of citizenship in this great country! |
Rocket Chris
Member Posts: 342
From:
Registered: Nov 2009
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posted 11-18-2011 11:03 AM
So is it not possible just to get the information where the tile was originally from? If one number isn't able to identify than it is not possible to identify the whole tile?In my FOIA request I already wrote that the tile is to be located in the area Gary mentioned. But it is still a question if left or right, which shuttle, flown or unflown status... V070- 191012- ?37-008695 So what do you think... should I try to get any information or should I just be satisfied with the message "no record found"? |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42981
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-18-2011 11:14 AM
The best you might do is submit a new FOIA request for information pertaining to any tiles with the numbers: - V070-191012-037-008695
- V070-191012-137-008695
- V070-191012-237-008695
- V070-191012-337-008695
- V070-191012-437-008695
- V070-191012-537-008695
- ...and onwards, up V070-191012-937-008695
But that could return multiple tiles and you would have no way to discerning which one was yours.By the way, what type of provenance did the collector in Europe have to sustain that he received as a "gift" from NASA? |
Rocket Chris
Member Posts: 342
From:
Registered: Nov 2009
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posted 11-18-2011 11:23 AM
If I would make a request for all these tiles including the problem report, I think I would not get any answer, but I could try.This person who owned the tile was a key person for the Spacelab module. My eyes began to shine bright when I saw what this person does have as gimmicks... Autographs from nearly all Apollo Astronauts, space flown stuff like flags, thermal blankets and so on as well as two tiles. So Rob... what to do now?  |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 42981
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 11-18-2011 11:51 AM
Were I you? I would forget about the FOIA and, if you haven't already, get the original owner of the tile to write a detailed letter describing the circumstances under which he was gifted it. Make sure it includes his title at the time of the presentation and where and when the tile was handed over. If it was inside the U.S., have him clearly state that he had the necessary permission to remove it from the country (presuming of course, he had such). |
Jim Behling
Member Posts: 1463
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010
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posted 11-18-2011 03:03 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Rocket Chris:
But it is still a question if left or right, which shuttle, flown or unflown status...
They won't have that type of data. That tile number is "generic" It is applicable to all orbiters and it is not unique, if it were flown, unflown, used, etc. |
Rocket Chris
Member Posts: 342
From:
Registered: Nov 2009
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posted 11-19-2011 03:21 AM
...that is not quite true. The tile is damaged and on the back red RTV 500 silicon is applied. Therefore it must have been attached to one of the shuttle's fuselage. So, the KSC problem report gives a fact where this tile was attached! I will try to get a picture next week. |
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