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Author
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Topic: Mission Control to Major Tom?
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Captain Apollo
Member Posts: 362
From: UK
Registered: Jun 2004
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posted 05-09-2024 12:55 AM
   
Trivial I know, but did NASA actually use the term "Ground Control" for manned flights? Or was it a British usage (from the RAF?) which came more naturally to David Bowie? |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 52362
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 05-10-2024 09:59 PM
I looked and couldn't find a citation of NASA using the term "ground control" prior to the release of "Space Oddity" in 1969, but there are examples in the press. Using The New York Times: - Schirra Cut Off Ground Control; Says He Was in Charge of Capsule for a Period — Houston Cheers Him (October 8, 1962)
- Ground Control Calls the Shots; The Mission Director Makes All Decisions on Flight (June 4, 1965)
I also looked to see if there were any interviews with David Bowie that would add insight. The best I could find (on Wikipedia and elsewhere), is that Bowie was inspired by "2001: A Space Odyssey" but that film does not use the term "ground control" as best I could determine.And I realize this wasn't part of your question, but NASA does use "ground control" today, and has done since the beginning of the space shuttle program. The Network console in Apollo mission control became Ground Control (GC), with responsibilities for overseeing the operation of the Mission Control Center and communications running to and from the building. |
Jim Behling
Member Posts: 1905
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010
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posted 05-11-2024 08:56 AM
It is an Air Force/Space Force term. |
Axman
Member Posts: 446
From: Derbyshire UK
Registered: Mar 2023
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posted 05-11-2024 10:13 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Jim Behling:
It is an Air Force/Space Force term.
It may well be. But David Bowie was a 22 year old Londoner from Brixton.The song Space Oddity was rush released to try and exploit the upcoming Apollo 11 moon shot, but was written and recorded many months prior to that. The term "Ground Control" in this instance derives from the terminology used first in 1920, when Croydon Airport near London, England, was the first airport in the world to introduce air traffic control. And is referenced by David Bowie's song writing partner, his manager, and his film making collaborator (Hutchinson, Pitt and Schneider - producer of German TV show 4-3-2-1 Musik Für Junge Leute, who used the German phrase Bodenkontrolle) when recording his second album. It is purely British usage and has no influence from NASA or the United States Air Force/Space Force... (although Major Tom and his tin can is/are clearly based upon the astronauts and their spacecraft in the Mercury program). |
Jim Behling
Member Posts: 1905
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010
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posted 05-11-2024 12:39 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Axman:
It is purely British usage and has no influence from NASA or the United States Air Force/Space Force... (although Major Tom and his tin can is/are clearly based upon the astronauts and their spacecraft in the Mercury program).
Can't say that because the term was used in the 50's and 60's in the space program for the launch or mission control center and for all types of launches, flights and missions (missile, satellite, crew, etc.) And because it was based on NASA's crew missions, the source is likely that. |
Axman
Member Posts: 446
From: Derbyshire UK
Registered: Mar 2023
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posted 05-11-2024 12:54 PM
I can say that because I followed David Bowie's career from before he was famous. He had a lot of influences that were particular and peculiar to his background and upbringing. NASA and the United States Air Force weren't evident in that mix. Arthur C Clarke and Stanley Kubrick played a glancing blow in that Bowie saw the film "2001: a Space Odyssey" once, which partially inspired his song, but as Robert has pointed out, despite being an American production of a British novel, didn't use the phrase "Ground Control." However, the filmmaker who produced Bowie's own film for his musical hit did use the term "bodenkontrolle" when describing the history of the film making (for the single, not 2001). |
Jim Behling
Member Posts: 1905
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010
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posted 05-11-2024 01:03 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Axman:
NASA and the United States Airforce weren't evident in that mix.
Can't say that either. NASA and the space program were prevalent in the news for the late 50's and most of the 60's. |
Axman
Member Posts: 446
From: Derbyshire UK
Registered: Mar 2023
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posted 05-11-2024 01:06 PM
But you can say that a phrase invented in Britain can only be used by a Brit because he heard it from American TV? How insular. How derogatory is that?I've given you particulars of when Bowie used the phrase. Can you please give me particulars of the widespread usage of "Ground Control" by NASA in newspapers, radio or TV a 22 year old Londoner would have come across? Remembering this was in mid to late 1968 when he wrote the song, many years before the Internet, and when very few transatlantic broadcasts were aired. I am currently sat down with my scrap books of press clippings starting in 1964. British press clippings. So far, and I'm up to the beginning of 1966 I've come across: - Ground Control - 0
- Mission Control - 22
I'll let you know if I find any Ground Controls.Bowie was an artist and musician. He wasn't an engineer, a space enthusiast, or an American. |
Jim Behling
Member Posts: 1905
From: Cape Canaveral, FL
Registered: Mar 2010
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posted 05-11-2024 03:01 PM
Yet he wrote a song about an American astronaut. And how would he know about aviation "ground control'? |
Robert Pearlman
Editor Posts: 52362
From: Houston, TX
Registered: Nov 1999
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posted 05-11-2024 03:51 PM
David Buckley, writing in his 2012 book "Strange Fascination – David Bowie: The Definitive Story," describes Bowie's passing fascination with UFOs and his interest in space exploration as it manifested itself in contemporary pop culture. Given the comic book nature of Bowie's interests at the time, as a piece of sci-fi writing "Space Oddity" is remarkably, perhaps deliberately, naive. Rather than dealing with the correct terminology, Bowie's lyrics are childlike and quaint. So we get 'ground control' for 'mission control', 'space ship' for 'rocket', 'Major Tom' instead of perhaps, 'Commander Tom' (indeed the use of the Christian name further distances the narrative from reality) and 'countdown' instead of 'ignition sequence.' The result is that Major Tom is a puppet, a Mr. Punch launched into space in a toilet roll rocket covered in tin foil, flying around the nursery ceiling rather than the cosmos... |
Blackarrow
Member Posts: 3714
From: Belfast, United Kingdom
Registered: Feb 2002
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posted 05-11-2024 03:55 PM
One point occurs to me: "Mission Control to Major Tom" doesn't scan. "Ground Control to Major Tom" does. I haven't a musical bone in my body, but I think a singer would pick words that fit neatly together to convey his meaning. |
Axman
Member Posts: 446
From: Derbyshire UK
Registered: Mar 2023
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posted 05-12-2024 01:42 AM
More particularly: The very popular British TV series Thunderbirds had the Landing Control Room sited in Cliff House on Tracy island.First aired October 1965 in the episode where Virgil Tracy returned to Tracy Island in a damaged Thunderbird 2, Jeff Tracy uses the phrase "Ground Control to Thunderbird 2" a number of times. The episode was repeated on ITV (in two parts before and after the ITN News), Granada and ATV Midlands in the UK in December 1968, the month when Bowie began to compose the demo tape of Space Oddity. |
Captain Apollo
Member Posts: 362
From: UK
Registered: Jun 2004
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posted 05-13-2024 06:38 AM
Thank you for your answers. |
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